I've been revisiting the Superman Triangle era of the 1990s, where for a decade the DC Superman editing office offered up essentially weekly Superman comics with ongoing narratives and multipart stories. DC then famously had three full-on weekly comics in 52, Countdown, and Trinity, the last of which had the same creative team! For your money what's the most impressive of editorial feat that the Distinguished Competition did?
Ref: Marvel prose novels: may I suggest to anyone interested to check out any of the Marvel books written by Stuart Moore. Stuart is not only a great, extremely experienced writer, but also a top notch editor and, as we say in the UK, a very good bloke. I hear ya about The Defenders, Tom, and nostalgia, but may I just quickly add that the reason they worked so well in their early-ish days could possibly be put into two words: Steve Gerber. That kinda lightning is near-impossible to bottle twice :-)
Gerber's Defenders is certainly my favorite run by a mile, but I think David Anthony Kraft, Peter Gillis, and to an extent J.M. DeMatteis all "got" the book in a similar way that made it not a "fake book." While the Avengers was a formal team with a roll-call, badges, yada yada, the Defenders was a group of friends hanging out. A lot of the drama in the series came from the efforts of one character (usually Nighthawk) trying to keep the band together. The Defenders is a relatable concept when one reflects on how hard it is sometimes to keep friendships up when the formal bonds that led to the formation of those friendships (attending the same school, working for the same employer, being neighbors) are broken for one reason or another but you still want to keep the relationships alive.
I agree. The original Defenders is one of the few team books that actually resonates with me because the premise is that all of Dr Strange's friends are superheroes and his house is their hangout spot. It's one of the only team books that DOESN'T feel artificial.
I am a big fan of the year or so by Len Wein and Sal Buscema - good old fashion fight books set in the classic Marvel U. The JM Dematteis era is also a lot of fun (loved his last arc with the integration of the original Xmen and Prof. Power). But my fave is the year long Busiek/Larsen run with the 'curse' bringing the Defenders together.
Dude. First of all, give people the benefit of the doubt. No one sets out to do a bad job. Second of all, how else does someone get to be a good writer other than writing?
"Because I don’t think there was ever much of anything that was on the page in any of the Krakoa stories that said anything of the kind."
Tom, not to be rude but that's just simply not true.
Jean was married to Scott (Hickman & Duggan's X-Men) and at minimum in a sexual relationship with Wolverine (X-Force, X Lives of Wolverine). Additionally Scott was romantically intangled with Emma (Cable, Duggan's X-Men) at the same time.
I get that the line moved away from this and focused on more "normal" pairings and relationships but I would hope you would trust your audience to understand what is happening on that page.
It *was* on the page, and Tom’s wrong about that - but at the same time it was only occasionally on the page and the outgoing office quietly dropped the whole thing a couple of years ago without bothering to resolve it, so I can’t see why the new books should feel under any greater obligation to mention it.
I agree in how things panned out. I think there's a whole crazy world of a difference if COVID doesn't happen and the line doesn't have a readjustment but that's all an exercise in What If.
Like what if they didn't have such a weird reaction to kitty kissing a girl
Congrats on the Eisner nomination, first of all, Tom. I know it's all old hat to you at this point, but hats of any vintage are more or less your brand, so I imagine it's pleasing nonetheless.
My question for you this week: Sean Howe, in his history of Marvel, related that one of Bob Harras's dissatisfactions with Chris Claremont was the writer's proclivity for filling X-Men comics with "stories about aliens and magic." The particular players here notwithstanding, this is a question that X-Men fans tend to debate to this day: how much should a "proper" X-Men story concern itself with mutant-themed, largely earthbound issues? And, conversely, how far can a story stray into the realms of Shi'ar, Limbo, or, indeed, Krakoa before it goes too far afield for the franchise?
The line you're editing, as we've seen, contains a wide array of different X-Men flavors. But is there a line for you where a story goes *too* far to be plausible or acceptable as X-Men material? Is there a core theme that, in some way or another, you like to see an X-Men book contain?
Well, Tom, I'm just here to eat crow. You've assembled a very diverse x-office, good job. Still feel like the teams could use a bit more diversity but my previous statement was definitely extremely premature and shortsighted
Tom, as the editor of a book and a line of books, is your responsibility solely to those books? Or does the good of the Marvel Universe overall also need to factored in? Or would you say that’s more for CB Cebulski and Dan Buckley (or whoever else I may not be aware of) to determine over you?
As an example, you and Dan Slott made the determination that it would be best for the Fantastic Four book if Franklin Richards was no longer a mutant. Any arguments to the contrary aside, let’s just say that you were right and it was for the best for Fantastic Four.
But that choice arguably benefiting one book forever severs a tie between that book and an entire line of books. It wipes away a key connective tissue between two franchises that the shared Marvel Universe concept is built on. It works to make the MU a smaller place rather than a larger place.
Do you view that as not your issue as the then-Fantastic Four editor? Your only responsibility being to what you believe is best for that one book?
hey tom, any chance of having a reunion between Logan and Mariko in the Wolverine ongoing since she is alive and this was not addressed in the Krakoa era?
The talk of Fear Itself brought about a memory about a different crossover--Bendis/Marquez's CIVIL WAR II.
I've long wondered what the 'Chicken and Egg' was behind that effort. Was the title decided on first, and then a story conceived to justify it? Or was a story pitting Iron Man vs Captain Marvel thought up first, and the title attached to it because it thematically fit?
Also, has a CIVIL WAR III (current Wolverine/Deadpool effort notwithstanding) been pitched at Marvel anytime after 2016?
Thanks for taking the time to look at my question, Tom. The aspects of the Krakoa Era that appealed to me the most was the focus on Mutant politics, Mutant philosophy and the goal of trying to build something new. Are there any books in the new line that will have these as a focus?
A related question: Will the Krakoan language, that was created by Cypher and implanted in every mutant's mind, still be a part of mutant culture going forward?
My favorite part was the rehabilitation of some of the 'villians' like Blob and Greycrow. I would have liked to have seen more of that during Krakoa and I hope that some of it sticks.
"MARVEL TEAM-UP, for example, was a fake book, a monthly title in which Spider-Man, the ultimate loner, outsider super hero regularly teamed up with other players from across the Marvel Universe."
I would argue that Spidey shouldn't be defined as a loner anymore, hasn't been one for quite some time. The FF and the Avengers and even the X-Men count on him, and viceversa. For my money, that's a definition that made sense decades ago, but shouldn't apply nowadays. Just my two cents on this subject, I simply would love to have Spidey in the Avengers again as he was during the Bendis years.
"I will say that I was the one who pitched the idea of Storm joining the Avengers to Jed and new editor Wil Moss once I realized that her presence in any of the other main X-Titles threatened to unbalance them, and that it would be an unexpected and hopefully shocking move—one that might potentially serve to elevate her as a solo character."
I have a question about this. Storm was not a part of New X-Men. Storm was not a part of Astonishing X-Men. When Schism happened, Wolverine & Cyclops were the two leaders. Storm was not an important part of the Marvel Now series, even if she was headmaster. She took a step back during the X-Men: Gold series, Kate was the leader back then. And, yes, she's been important in Krakoa, but I would argue she hasn't exactly been at the forefront.
What I mean by all this is that I feel that she just hasn't been there when it might have actually helped to elevate her character. And now, when we are about to have a new era, new spotlights... I get the solo series, I get her being in the Avengers. Those make sense. What I don't get is how she being out of the three core titles of the line help her. Imagine if in 20 years we are talking about From The Ashes era in the same vein as we do the New X-men era or the Krakoa era. And, once again, she is not are the forefront. She is not in The Moments, in The Stories. Isn't that a missed opportunity? If the plan is the give her more strength as a character, shouldn't one of the books be build so she can have that spotlight in her home book and franchise.
Of course, I understand I have no idea where the narrative is gonna go and how things are gonna work. I also talk as a person who isn't a fan of Storm, not specially at least. But, as strategies go, I fail to see the logic behind this one. Can you share something about how this plan came together and why do you and your team feel this is the right move?
I get that not using a #1 for a new run is self-defeating. Do you have any idea what could be the reason that Distinguished Competition decided to start their latest Batman run at #125 - with numbering from 2016, while casually relaunching Superman and Wonder Woman? I get that you can't know the reason, and might not want to share your opinions of the competitors. Just asking if you *have any* ideas, as I do not get it at all.
My guess is that it's Batman, it doesn't really need a new #1 with how many miniseries and other books he is in. There is also some strength in a big number, and Batman can surely do that. My guess is that Spider-Man could do that as well, but Marvel politics are different from DC politics.
I actually can throw out a simple guess that Wonder Woman had a scary, 8XX number due to LGY, while Superman was leaving its time as Jon’s book, Son of Kal El. If you look closely, you actually see DC seems less interested in going back to #1 than Marvel, with Flash being basically the only other book to do so, also entering LGY 8XX like Wonder Woman.
Before my question, I just want to say new X-Factor run is a book basically made for me, thank you. I’ll cry if it gets cancelled. This is my case for giving it Peter David levels of length.
My question is closely related however: We’ve seen a lot of skepticism and what can best be called defeatism, even in those excited, for this upcoming relaunch. We’ve seen it a lot in this week’s newsletter. Why do you think that is? Recent early cancellations? A history of short lived X-Solos? People just getting themselves excited? Some other thing I haven’t even thought of?
I love Commie Smasher era Cap. When I used to work at one of Tom's old go to stores in Delaware, whenever our Marvel/Diamond/Heroes World rep would ask for reprint/collection selections, we always included Commie Smasher Cap on the list. So, as a question, anything classic from the Marvel Vault you'd still love to see reprinted after all this time?
Scott might love Jean more but he has a healthier relationship with Emma.
I've been revisiting the Superman Triangle era of the 1990s, where for a decade the DC Superman editing office offered up essentially weekly Superman comics with ongoing narratives and multipart stories. DC then famously had three full-on weekly comics in 52, Countdown, and Trinity, the last of which had the same creative team! For your money what's the most impressive of editorial feat that the Distinguished Competition did?
Ref: Marvel prose novels: may I suggest to anyone interested to check out any of the Marvel books written by Stuart Moore. Stuart is not only a great, extremely experienced writer, but also a top notch editor and, as we say in the UK, a very good bloke. I hear ya about The Defenders, Tom, and nostalgia, but may I just quickly add that the reason they worked so well in their early-ish days could possibly be put into two words: Steve Gerber. That kinda lightning is near-impossible to bottle twice :-)
Gerber's Defenders is certainly my favorite run by a mile, but I think David Anthony Kraft, Peter Gillis, and to an extent J.M. DeMatteis all "got" the book in a similar way that made it not a "fake book." While the Avengers was a formal team with a roll-call, badges, yada yada, the Defenders was a group of friends hanging out. A lot of the drama in the series came from the efforts of one character (usually Nighthawk) trying to keep the band together. The Defenders is a relatable concept when one reflects on how hard it is sometimes to keep friendships up when the formal bonds that led to the formation of those friendships (attending the same school, working for the same employer, being neighbors) are broken for one reason or another but you still want to keep the relationships alive.
I agree. The original Defenders is one of the few team books that actually resonates with me because the premise is that all of Dr Strange's friends are superheroes and his house is their hangout spot. It's one of the only team books that DOESN'T feel artificial.
I remember there being some good ones in the 90s, including the Cap one by I think Tony Isabella and Bob Ingersoll.
I am a big fan of the year or so by Len Wein and Sal Buscema - good old fashion fight books set in the classic Marvel U. The JM Dematteis era is also a lot of fun (loved his last arc with the integration of the original Xmen and Prof. Power). But my fave is the year long Busiek/Larsen run with the 'curse' bringing the Defenders together.
Would really love stronger writers on these books. The writers for Storm and Wolverine aren't writers who should be writing your top 2 characters.
Readers like myself would rather read books by good writers
Dude. First of all, give people the benefit of the doubt. No one sets out to do a bad job. Second of all, how else does someone get to be a good writer other than writing?
"Because I don’t think there was ever much of anything that was on the page in any of the Krakoa stories that said anything of the kind."
Tom, not to be rude but that's just simply not true.
Jean was married to Scott (Hickman & Duggan's X-Men) and at minimum in a sexual relationship with Wolverine (X-Force, X Lives of Wolverine). Additionally Scott was romantically intangled with Emma (Cable, Duggan's X-Men) at the same time.
I get that the line moved away from this and focused on more "normal" pairings and relationships but I would hope you would trust your audience to understand what is happening on that page.
It *was* on the page, and Tom’s wrong about that - but at the same time it was only occasionally on the page and the outgoing office quietly dropped the whole thing a couple of years ago without bothering to resolve it, so I can’t see why the new books should feel under any greater obligation to mention it.
I agree in how things panned out. I think there's a whole crazy world of a difference if COVID doesn't happen and the line doesn't have a readjustment but that's all an exercise in What If.
Like what if they didn't have such a weird reaction to kitty kissing a girl
Congrats on the Eisner nomination, first of all, Tom. I know it's all old hat to you at this point, but hats of any vintage are more or less your brand, so I imagine it's pleasing nonetheless.
My question for you this week: Sean Howe, in his history of Marvel, related that one of Bob Harras's dissatisfactions with Chris Claremont was the writer's proclivity for filling X-Men comics with "stories about aliens and magic." The particular players here notwithstanding, this is a question that X-Men fans tend to debate to this day: how much should a "proper" X-Men story concern itself with mutant-themed, largely earthbound issues? And, conversely, how far can a story stray into the realms of Shi'ar, Limbo, or, indeed, Krakoa before it goes too far afield for the franchise?
The line you're editing, as we've seen, contains a wide array of different X-Men flavors. But is there a line for you where a story goes *too* far to be plausible or acceptable as X-Men material? Is there a core theme that, in some way or another, you like to see an X-Men book contain?
I might be about to lick the third rail, but where’s Jordan White going?
Well, Tom, I'm just here to eat crow. You've assembled a very diverse x-office, good job. Still feel like the teams could use a bit more diversity but my previous statement was definitely extremely premature and shortsighted
Tom, as the editor of a book and a line of books, is your responsibility solely to those books? Or does the good of the Marvel Universe overall also need to factored in? Or would you say that’s more for CB Cebulski and Dan Buckley (or whoever else I may not be aware of) to determine over you?
As an example, you and Dan Slott made the determination that it would be best for the Fantastic Four book if Franklin Richards was no longer a mutant. Any arguments to the contrary aside, let’s just say that you were right and it was for the best for Fantastic Four.
But that choice arguably benefiting one book forever severs a tie between that book and an entire line of books. It wipes away a key connective tissue between two franchises that the shared Marvel Universe concept is built on. It works to make the MU a smaller place rather than a larger place.
Do you view that as not your issue as the then-Fantastic Four editor? Your only responsibility being to what you believe is best for that one book?
hey tom, any chance of having a reunion between Logan and Mariko in the Wolverine ongoing since she is alive and this was not addressed in the Krakoa era?
The talk of Fear Itself brought about a memory about a different crossover--Bendis/Marquez's CIVIL WAR II.
I've long wondered what the 'Chicken and Egg' was behind that effort. Was the title decided on first, and then a story conceived to justify it? Or was a story pitting Iron Man vs Captain Marvel thought up first, and the title attached to it because it thematically fit?
Also, has a CIVIL WAR III (current Wolverine/Deadpool effort notwithstanding) been pitched at Marvel anytime after 2016?
Thanks for taking the time to look at my question, Tom. The aspects of the Krakoa Era that appealed to me the most was the focus on Mutant politics, Mutant philosophy and the goal of trying to build something new. Are there any books in the new line that will have these as a focus?
A related question: Will the Krakoan language, that was created by Cypher and implanted in every mutant's mind, still be a part of mutant culture going forward?
My favorite part was the rehabilitation of some of the 'villians' like Blob and Greycrow. I would have liked to have seen more of that during Krakoa and I hope that some of it sticks.
"MARVEL TEAM-UP, for example, was a fake book, a monthly title in which Spider-Man, the ultimate loner, outsider super hero regularly teamed up with other players from across the Marvel Universe."
I would argue that Spidey shouldn't be defined as a loner anymore, hasn't been one for quite some time. The FF and the Avengers and even the X-Men count on him, and viceversa. For my money, that's a definition that made sense decades ago, but shouldn't apply nowadays. Just my two cents on this subject, I simply would love to have Spidey in the Avengers again as he was during the Bendis years.
"I will say that I was the one who pitched the idea of Storm joining the Avengers to Jed and new editor Wil Moss once I realized that her presence in any of the other main X-Titles threatened to unbalance them, and that it would be an unexpected and hopefully shocking move—one that might potentially serve to elevate her as a solo character."
I have a question about this. Storm was not a part of New X-Men. Storm was not a part of Astonishing X-Men. When Schism happened, Wolverine & Cyclops were the two leaders. Storm was not an important part of the Marvel Now series, even if she was headmaster. She took a step back during the X-Men: Gold series, Kate was the leader back then. And, yes, she's been important in Krakoa, but I would argue she hasn't exactly been at the forefront.
What I mean by all this is that I feel that she just hasn't been there when it might have actually helped to elevate her character. And now, when we are about to have a new era, new spotlights... I get the solo series, I get her being in the Avengers. Those make sense. What I don't get is how she being out of the three core titles of the line help her. Imagine if in 20 years we are talking about From The Ashes era in the same vein as we do the New X-men era or the Krakoa era. And, once again, she is not are the forefront. She is not in The Moments, in The Stories. Isn't that a missed opportunity? If the plan is the give her more strength as a character, shouldn't one of the books be build so she can have that spotlight in her home book and franchise.
Of course, I understand I have no idea where the narrative is gonna go and how things are gonna work. I also talk as a person who isn't a fan of Storm, not specially at least. But, as strategies go, I fail to see the logic behind this one. Can you share something about how this plan came together and why do you and your team feel this is the right move?
I get that not using a #1 for a new run is self-defeating. Do you have any idea what could be the reason that Distinguished Competition decided to start their latest Batman run at #125 - with numbering from 2016, while casually relaunching Superman and Wonder Woman? I get that you can't know the reason, and might not want to share your opinions of the competitors. Just asking if you *have any* ideas, as I do not get it at all.
My guess is that it's Batman, it doesn't really need a new #1 with how many miniseries and other books he is in. There is also some strength in a big number, and Batman can surely do that. My guess is that Spider-Man could do that as well, but Marvel politics are different from DC politics.
I actually can throw out a simple guess that Wonder Woman had a scary, 8XX number due to LGY, while Superman was leaving its time as Jon’s book, Son of Kal El. If you look closely, you actually see DC seems less interested in going back to #1 than Marvel, with Flash being basically the only other book to do so, also entering LGY 8XX like Wonder Woman.
Before my question, I just want to say new X-Factor run is a book basically made for me, thank you. I’ll cry if it gets cancelled. This is my case for giving it Peter David levels of length.
My question is closely related however: We’ve seen a lot of skepticism and what can best be called defeatism, even in those excited, for this upcoming relaunch. We’ve seen it a lot in this week’s newsletter. Why do you think that is? Recent early cancellations? A history of short lived X-Solos? People just getting themselves excited? Some other thing I haven’t even thought of?
I love Commie Smasher era Cap. When I used to work at one of Tom's old go to stores in Delaware, whenever our Marvel/Diamond/Heroes World rep would ask for reprint/collection selections, we always included Commie Smasher Cap on the list. So, as a question, anything classic from the Marvel Vault you'd still love to see reprinted after all this time?